Things you DON'T Like About the Show

[marlboro]

I'm sure we're all big fans of Magnum, but who doesn't like to nitpick, right?

A few minor things that I didn't like

Psychic powers. I have no idea why they would introduce this angle to the show. I've always disliked the idea of psychic detectives. Why bother with deductive reasoning when you can just have a serendipitous psychic flash? I have no problem with the "little voice" aka a "hunch" but I draw the line at him Magnum seeing into the future and knowing that Sharon Stone is about to be attacked by a dog. I also hated how random it was. You would think that periodically having psychic abilities would be something that would have a big impact on a character, but on this show it would pop up for one episode every season or two and would never be mentioned again.


Supernatural elements.

Ghosts, kahunas, and whatever the heck that was going on in "Flashback." This stuff would have been fine on Kolchak or the X-Files, but it always seemed extremely out of place in this show.

Cute kids.

Willie and Tran Quoc Jones - 'nuff said.

Sports themed episodes.

Granted, there weren't many of them, but they were pretty forgettable.

Only one J. "Digger" Doyle appearance.

We got two Lt. Gordon Katsumoto episodes...


Carol Baldwin.

I just never warmed to her character. She was always so manipulative. "The Love That Lies" was a good episode and made the character a lot more likable, but it came in season 8. I wish Patty McCormack had been able to keep the role.

Magnum being childish.

After the first couple of seasons the writers really went overboard playing up the childish aspects of Magnum's relationship with Higgins. The whining and petulant yelling were supposed to be funny, but it was just too much for me. In one season he's executing a Russian. A little later, he's throwing a hissy fit about being woken up too early.

Magnum being forced to grow up/wearing giant reading glasses.

To compensate for Magnum's childish characteristics, the writers came up a handful of episodes where Magnum is told that he needs to "grow up." Get a "real" job, start wearing giganto old man glasses, etc. I think this misses the whole point of the show. It's like the writer of a comic book deciding that Batman should put away the cape and start focusing all of his attention on doing Bruce Wayne's taxes. We want to watch a show about a detective, living in paradise, solving crimes and helping people with the aid of his friends. We don't need the writers implying that it is wrong for Magnum to do what he does or that he should feel guilty about it. Magnum rejoining the Navy in the final episode was the culmination of this silliness.

Magnum's family.

I hated all of them, the belligerent stepfather, the doormat mom, and the bitchy aunt.


T.C. becoming a saint.

T.C. worked great as a loyal best friend with a good sense of humor. But instead of being a regular dude, they fleshed him out by making him a bit of a goody two shoes. No drinking, no strip clubs, willing to fight in semi legal underground fight clubs for strangers, little league coach, father figure to Asian orphans, Magnum's light shrouded conscience when he's about to kill Quang Ki (!) and on and on. The Pope would envy this guy's resume. And while I like Roger Mosley, I don't think he has the acting chops to do the heavy drama that the later T.C. centric episodes consisted of. Where the heck did that ex wife and kids come from and where had they been for all those years? Give me the T.C. who wants to wear a macho Lei any day.

Mac.

He was an ok secondary character in the beginning. Nothing special. He could have been easily replaced by Maggie or by a Macintosh sitting on Higgins' desk. I really have no idea why they thought he was so invaluable that they had to resurrect him in such a ridiculous fashion. I couldn't stand Mac 2.0

Magnum being forced to team up with annoying female characters.

It's a classic scenario that can be very entertaining, but the show went to the well way too often. There had to be at least a dozen episodes with this setup. Many of them were terrible.

Killing Magnum/Resurrecting him/Final Episode

I think the show had a bit of a resurgence in season 7. Some really great episodes; "Laura" "Death and Taxes" "Little Girl Who" are all classics imo. And there were several more that i really liked. But the story line that ran from "The People vs. Orville Wright" to "Resolutions" was incredibly weak. Just one disappointing episode after another. Honestly, I just do a little reshuffling of a couple of season 8 episodes and pretend that "Forty" was the final episode of the series.




...having said all that - it's still an awesome show.

[marlboro]

Off topic question - what the heck was the episode where Magnum is busy on a case so he gets TC to check up on a young man for another client? I think the client's daughter is engaged to the young man or something and he wants a background check done on him. TC suspects that the boy is growing dope but it turns out that he is just growing flowers or something harmless. This was the B plot of another episode.

There may have been a scene where Magnum tries to pick a fancy lock on the kid's van.

I remember it as having some great TC. moments, but I am completely drawing a blank.


EDIT: finally remembered. It was "Forty Years From Sand Island."

[Little Garwood]

Most of what you've listed occurs in seasons 5-8, and I dislike a LOT of what seasons 5-8 were doing. Though there are some absolute classics in the show's second half, but far too much of MPI was hit-and-miss during those last four seasons. Even as a 13-14 year-old in 1984-85, I found myself many times switching off MPI in favor of--get ready for it--The Cosby Show. Even my second-favorite show of that time, Simon & Simon, also changed beginning with its fifth season as well. Suffering from "The Cutes" and far too many lightweight--even for S&S--stories.

The supernatural stuff. I despise it in general and I am not a religious/superstitious person at all--as in the Richard Dawkins-Douglas Adams-Christopher Hitchens sort of way, so I don't like it in my entertainment, either.

Mac--the second Mac, anyway; he's the Angel Martin of Magnum, P.I, although Angel was a much more likable character.

I got tired of Magnum's latter-season voiceovers where he seemingly introduced an unlimited number of wise aunts and uncles with their idiotic Mark Twain wannabe philosophy. I agree with you about his onscreen family, as well; but then TC, Rick, and Higgins were Thomas' family by choice, which is far more realistic than showing misplaced loyalty in one's birth family, since the only reason why one is with those people is through an accident of birth. Just because one is born into a family by way of some cosmic lottery doesn't mean one must love, or even like, said family.

Magnum rejoining the USN--that's two steps back instead of one step forward. That writers-out-of-ideas decision completely reverses Thomas' early-season resentment of the military bureaucracy and resigning his commission. It's just one more reason why I rarely watch the second-half of MPI's run straight through. I hated the end of S7 and the end of S8 so I never watch Limbo or Resolutions. If I knew that the last song i would ever hear was something by John Denver, I would choose to live forever, or more realistically, die deaf.

TC becoming a saint is Political Correctness, pure and simple. Maybe he should have changed his name to "P.C."

There's also something about the garish, bloated decade of the 1980s--particularly the second half--when I became turned off of TV and pop culture in general. I essentially stopped watching prime time TV in 1986 and that includes MPI and I've never really gone back! The sitcom took precedence over the one-hour adventure show and I've never been much of a sitcom guy (The Odd Couple; my sacred and beloved M*A*S*H and a few others, mostly early '70s stuff) and the 1980s were simply putrid in general. I've never had any nostalgia for bilge like the A-Team; Knight Rider, or Miami Vice. It was garbage then and it looks even worse now. I'm for more of a 1965-75 fan of the way TV shows were than the programs of my childhood (1976-86; give or take).

But yes, Magnum P.I. is still a brilliant show and one which has actually given me nothing but happiness--despite my rant above--but if I didn't truly love it, I wouldn't care enough to point out its faults, since I care so much about its characters, which is far more important than any storyline deficiencies--except when they come at the expense of the characters.

[Little Garwood]

Oh! How could I have forgotten my number one grievance with Magnum, P.I.?!? The completely stupid, tacked-on belief that Higgins is Robin Masters. I abhor that concept more than any other fault that this show has.

[marlboro]

I'm not a fan of that plot line either. It would have been ok as a humorous B plot for one episode, but to stretch it out over two seasons and treating it like it was legitimately possible for Higgins to be Masters after several seasons worth of contradictory evidence was a mistake.

It all started with "Paper War" I think. I know that a lot of people like that episode, but I don't care for it. Higgins and Magnum treated each other terribly. It just wasn't believable seeing them act that way after 7 seasons of them growing together as friends. The worst part was TM calling Higgins a liar. I just don't believe he would ever do that. It would probably have worked better as a first season episode.

[Little Garwood]

I'm not a fan of that plot line either. It would have been ok as a humorous B plot for one episode, but to stretch it out over two seasons and treating it like it was legitimately possible for Higgins to be Masters after reversal seasons worth of contradictory evidence was a mistake.

It all started with "Paper War" I think. I know that a lot of people like that episode, but I don't care for it. Higgins and Magnum treated each other terribly. It just wasn't believable seeing them act that way after 7 seasons of them growing together as friends. The worst part was TM calling Higgins a liar. I just don't believe he would ever do that. It would probably have worked better as a first season episode.

I agree. Besides, after tremendous character-bonding episodes like Home from the Sea and All for One, there should have been no way that Thomas and Higgins could have ever gone back to such contentious behavior, which in my view was exaggerated in Paper War to character-sacrificing comic effect, which is one of my main pet peeves for any TV show; don't ever destroy the delicate balance between characters just for the sake of one comedic episode.

[BWheelz54]

Hey thanks for this thread! The comments hit a lot of irks I also had with Magnum's last several seasons. The comment that Magnum's return to the Navy was two steps back rather than forward really hit the spot. I felt that at some point near the middle of Magnum's run that the writers, or Selleck, or the network, or whoever decided that the Magnum was just an irresponsible adult-adolescent freeloading at the estate. I really enjoy hearing some of Selleck's interviews from the time, and from now on looking back at the show, and I am surprised how often Selleck sums Magnum's character up in that way. I really disagree with that sentiment. The guy just serves multiple tours for his country in Vietnam and continues to help so many clients with no mention of compensation. Maybe the early Magnum was not a saint, but I certainly thought him to be much more than an irresponsible freeloader on the estate. I thought some of those early flaws were what made Thomas such an approachable leading character.

Perusing some of the articles so well gathered on Magnum Mania makes me kinda realize how much pressure the network must have been putting on Magnum to be the uno numero one big hit. I wonder if the execs wanted it to Magnum, PI and Miami Vice and Cosby Show all wrapped together. That would have been unfair. But I wonder if this fed into some sentiment that Mr. Magnum "had to get his act together." Magnum had to become kinda an inflated image of the "All-American" and "wholesome" man. Does that even exist? I was too young at the time to know, but did any kind of culture politics come into play? I hope this doesn't sound unfair or "liberal," I really don't like politics much, but could some of this be the Ronald Reagan era washing off on our fun-loving Magnum? (Please I don't mean that to suggest President Reagan was a bad president, just wondering a bit).

I often wonder while watching the second half of the run where all the cool "espionage" episodes sneak off to. The second half seems to drift away from so many cool ideas that might involve Magnum's time in intelligence, and with Higgins' time in intelligence. Even the cool historical references seem to vanish. It just seems to me that by the second half of the run that Magnum PI became a victim of its lightning in a bottle success and attracted the attention of all the bean-counting executives who wanted to milk it for all the dough, though they themselves were probably not at all very creative people.

Oh, rambled again a bit. But I just don't know why it seems to me that Magnum had to become so grown-up and straight-laced during the series' second half. You know, after I watch the final episode, I am always wondering if I'm supposed to believe that Magnum felt guilty during all of his years away from the Navy, and if he felt his time at the estate was wasted. That's really why I disliked where the series ended. Thanks again all.

[marlboro]

Maybe Selleck was feeling self conscience. There is a movie called "Breezy" where a character says "Being old means feeling foolish." I'm paraphrasing here. The gist of it is true in a lot of ways. You look back on your youth and can't believe the things you did. And you are too afraid of looking foolish to ever do anything risky or nonconformist again. Maybe he felt too old for the role? Who knows?

What's weird about it is that they write scenes with Magnum having childish arguments with Higgins in one episode, and then will have a couple of lines about him needing to grow up in the next. Wouldn't it have been a lot easier to just not include the childish bits?

What is the message of "Resolutions"? By having Magnum reenlist it's almost like saying that the entire series is a mistake on Magnum's part. Like the entire 8 years was just a big tantrum he has thrown to avoid growing up. I completely disagree with that. Magnum, as originally written was a hero. He served his country. He was loyal to his friends. He helped people who couldn't help themselves. He put his life on the line countless times. But since he wore shorts instead of a tie none of that mattered. He was just some dude going through an early midlife crisis or something.

Having him reenlist shows contempt for the basic concept of the show and for the audience. I know it sounds extreme, but I don't know how anyone could watch the show for 8 years - much less be involved in the making of it - and think that Magnum would ever put himself in a situation again where he would have to take orders from a man like Buck Green.

"What I guess I hadn't considered was that feeling of claustrophobia. Not the kind you get in elevators and airplanes, and small places, but the kind I felt in high school, the IRS office, and sometimes with Higgins. Those situations where other people were making my rules, where I had absolutely no control."

Since when is repeating the mistakes of your youth a sign of maturity?


Having Magnum reup is akin to having Richard Kimble plead guilty to murdering his wife at the end of The Fugitive.

[Stelth]

Carol is the only element of the show I really despise.

[Luther's nephew Dobie]

Hi Guys,
What a terrific thread, each post had a lot of thoughtful takes on Magnum PI.
BWHEEL wrote that
" Magnum had to become kinda an inflated image of the "All-American"... did any kind of culture politics come into play? I hope this doesn't sound unfair or "liberal," I really don't like politics much, but could some of this be the Ronald Reagan era washing off on our fun-loving Magnum?"

BW, you are correct. The pendulum had swung back from the anti military hangover from the Vietnam War to perhaps a little bit of a over correction, 'patriotism' wise. We splashed two Libyan Migs into the Med and the media celebrated like it was Midway. Same for the invasion of Grenada, in many ways a cluster duck but it was showers of medals for everyone, down to the guy in charge of the Honeywagons.
Every soldier became a hero, which continues to this day. Most people in uniform are just doing their duty and would be the 1st to tell you they aren't heros, it's embarrassing when outsiders tell them so or are promoting them as heros for angles of their own.
For example, the latest Medal of Honor winner from a few weeks ago, a elderly vet of the Vietnam War? He said he wasn't a hero, he was doing his duty, the heros are his buddies who didnt make it back. See, the subtext of winning a valour award is that by it's very nature it means you were in very heavy, extended combat, which means that lots of your buddies got killed.
Thats a very private memory, full of horrors, not for outsiders but your brothers in arms or later on for your wife when you wake up screaming in the early AM. So when the slob at the corner bar regales the citizens with his 'what a warrior I am' stories, he more than likely was, like my buddy Dave in the 82nd during the Grenada Invasion, stuck in charge of the Honeywagon detail at Fort Bragg.
Sorry to go on a tangent but yes BWHEEL the politics of the time combined with the old fashioned mindset of CBS - not that thats bad - did affect the series it aired such as Magnum and I thought so at the time. Because as noted the last thing Magnum would have done was to go back in the Navy
and possibly even wind up under Buck Green.
Dobie

Higgins: As you may have noticed, I've fired the groundskeeper. Until I can find a successor, I'd like you to assume some of the responsibilities.
Magnum: But Higgins, I don't know the first thing about gardening!
Higgins: I assure you, the kind of work I had in mind requires no intelligence what so ever.
Magnum: Like what?
Higgins: Like distributing 1500 lbs. of recycled vegetation that was delivered this morning.
Magnum: Recycled vegetation!? What do you mean 'recycled vegetation'? Recycled how?
Higgins: [smiles] Through a cow.

[marlboro]

Carol is the only element of the show I really despise.

My problem with Carol is that she is so manipulative. When she gets called on it her defense is "So are you, Magnum." Which is true to an extent, but there is a major difference: while Magnum does manipulate Rick and T.C. constantly, he has been shown to be willing to put his life on the line to help them out time and time again. They are long time friends who have been to hell and back together.

I wish Doc Ibold and Lt. Tanaka had been used more frequently instead of Carol. Carol used Magnum to do work outside of what she could do as a prosecutor. I think TM could have acted in the same capacity for Tanaka.

Sorry to go on a tangent but yes BWHEEL the politics of the time combined with the old fashioned mindset of CBS - not that thats bad - did affect the series it aired such as Magnum and I thought so at the time. Because as noted the last thing Magnum would have done was to go back in the Navy
and possibly even wind up under Buck Green.

I partially agree with your comment. I think that the show consistently showed soldiers in a positive light, while simultaneously making the military system look bad.

Which makes the last episode even more baffling. You spend 8 years making a distinction between the soldier and the "system" and then throw it all out the window in the last few minutes.

[Lindsay Writer]

The show lost a lot of its energy for action and adventure and inventive mysteries and suspense when Bellisario walked away from it. He stopped writing it and he stopped supervising the other writers he was totally gone but they kept his name on it for every freeze-frame at the end which I think was wrong and dishonest. Selleck hired writers who took the show in a direction nobody liked. Don went off and did Airwolf then Quantum Leap and during that time Magnum was still flying but without an expert pilot. I'm watching Faith & Begorrah right now on Cozi TV and it's terrible this was one of the few Bellisario-written episodes that stunk. He must have been out of ideas for this one it was the last episode of the season and it's painfully dull it's terrible.

[Stelth]

I watched that one yesterday too. I like it, though. Also, the ending with Rick and T.C. is bizarre and unintentionally hilarious.

[marlboro]

I'm watching Faith & Begorrah right now on Cozi TV and it's terrible this was one of the few Bellisario-written episodes that stunk.

Hey, a man can only do so many things at once. You don't expect expect him to be able to watch the desk, answer the phone, eat dinner, catch up on modern American literature and write Emmy worthy scripts at the same time do you?

[Steve]

The only thing I really hated was the killing off of Lt. Tanaka. It made no sense unless they were going to have an ongoing revenge story line ala Michell and that would have been hard to do as there were only eight episodes left in the series............