Thomas Magnum's Gun - Some Documentation

[To The Regiment]

I ran across this Gun Digest story from December 2020 titled "The Flash and Oddity of Hollywood 1911s": https://gundigest.com/handguns/the-flas ... wood-1911s

It's an interesting read, but what piqued my interest was the hi-res closeup photo of a Colt Series 70 1911 used in the original Magnum, PI production. This one is owned by Independent Studio Services and was test fired by the author of the Gun Digest story. Note the walnut grip, which differs from the plastic GI grips on the NRA Museum's Magnum, PI prop gun.

Best,
To The Regiment

Good read. And that picture of his Colt is very cool!

Interestingly, neither the Magnum, PI Colt owned by ISS nor the one on display at the NRA Museum (which is now closed) appear to be the one in this screenshot:



Note the apparent scratch on this Colt's slide near the end.

Best,
To The Regiment

Having worked in production for a few years, I can say that there were almost certainly several prop guns used in the series, none of which could fire. Lower budget productions use completely fake weapons, while those wanting more realism use actual weapons, but doing so requires following an entire set of regulations and procedures that cost time and money. An armourer is required to follow a large number of procedures even when a “dummy” weapon can’t even fire blanks. They must visually demonstrate it before each take. The firing of blanks brings eye and ear protection for all the crew and even more procedures, costing more time and money. The close-up shown is likely a dummy weapon, one of several to make sure productions isn’t delayed in any way.

Absolutely fascinating. Thank you for those insights. Do you think either the ISS Colt or the NRA Museum Colt could be traced back to any specific episodes?

Best,
To The Regiment

[Pahonu]

I ran across this Gun Digest story from December 2020 titled "The Flash and Oddity of Hollywood 1911s": https://gundigest.com/handguns/the-flas ... wood-1911s

It's an interesting read, but what piqued my interest was the hi-res closeup photo of a Colt Series 70 1911 used in the original Magnum, PI production. This one is owned by Independent Studio Services and was test fired by the author of the Gun Digest story. Note the walnut grip, which differs from the plastic GI grips on the NRA Museum's Magnum, PI prop gun.

Best,
To The Regiment

Good read. And that picture of his Colt is very cool!

Interestingly, neither the Magnum, PI Colt owned by ISS nor the one on display at the NRA Museum (which is now closed) appear to be the one in this screenshot:



Note the apparent scratch on this Colt's slide near the end.

Best,
To The Regiment

Having worked in production for a few years, I can say that there were almost certainly several prop guns used in the series, none of which could fire. Lower budget productions use completely fake weapons, while those wanting more realism use actual weapons, but doing so requires following an entire set of regulations and procedures that cost time and money. An armourer is required to follow a large number of procedures even when a “dummy” weapon can’t even fire blanks. They must visually demonstrate it before each take. The firing of blanks brings eye and ear protection for all the crew and even more procedures, costing more time and money. The close-up shown is likely a dummy weapon, one of several to make sure productions isn’t delayed in any way.

Absolutely fascinating. Thank you for those insights. Do you think either the ISS Colt or the NRA Museum Colt could be traced back to any specific episodes?

Best,
To The Regiment

I honestly have no idea but it would seem very difficult to do so other than by visual comparison I suppose. I have limited knowledge of guns in general, but experienced their use in several productions and learned about the regulations and procedures on set in that way. It was usually the AD who was responsible for safety on the set and dealt directly with the armourer. The weapons were locked up and their use closely controlled by that individual. I imagine the armourer would have kept notes about the production at that time, but that was so long ago. As I’ve explained elsewhere in the forum, I was given lots of paperwork regarding daily production details in the years I was involved and have almost none of it. I only happened across a couple of call sheets that had gotten mixed in with other paperwork somehow. It would be like keeping notes taken at a meeting from a job 30 years ago. It was just part of the job for that day/week/episode/film. I never imagined in the early 90’s that forums of people like this would be interested in all the minutiae of each day’s production.

[To The Regiment]

[/quote]

I honestly have no idea but it would seem very difficult to do so other than by visual comparison I suppose. I have limited knowledge of guns in general, but experienced their use in several productions and learned about the regulations and procedures on set in that way. It was usually the AD who was responsible for safety on the set and dealt directly with the armourer. The weapons were locked up and their use closely controlled by that individual. I imagine the armourer would have kept notes about the production at that time, but that was so long ago. As I’ve explained elsewhere in the forum, I was given lots of paperwork regarding daily production details in the years I was involved and have almost none of it. I only happened across a couple of call sheets that had gotten mixed in with other paperwork somehow. It would be like keeping notes taken at a meeting from a job 30 years ago. It was just part of the job for that day/week/episode/film. I never imagined in the early 90’s that forums of people like this would be interested in all the minutiae of each day’s production.
[/quote]

Great insights. Thank you, Pahonu. It'll be interesting to see if any additional prop guns from Magnum eventually surface.

Best,
To The Regiment

[MaximRecoil]

Interestingly, neither the Magnum, PI Colt owned by ISS nor the one on display at the NRA Museum (which is now closed) appear to be the one in this screenshot:



Note the apparent scratch on this Colt's slide near the end.

Yeah, that prop, which was used in at least several episodes, is particularly interesting because it has a partial-shelf thumb safety, and it absolutely did not come that way from Colt. The one from the NRA museum also had a partial-shelf thumb safety (which you can see in the picture I posted in post #35), so it's probably the same gun. If it isn't, it means that at least two of the props were modified in the same way. The ISS one has its stock full-shelf thumb safety like Colt has been using since the early 1950s, and there are indeed plenty of episodes where Magnum's pistol has the stock full-shelf thumb safety.

Installing a partial-shelf thumb safety was some nice attention to detail, because all USGI M1911s and M1911A1s had a partial-shelf thumb safety (they were all manufactured before Colt introduced the full-shelf thumb safety). Here's a comparison between the stock full-shelf thumb safety on the ISS pistol (top) and the not-stock-for-that-particular-gun partial-shelf thumb safety on the NRA Museum pistol (bottom):



Since the partial-shelf thumb safety on the NRA Museum pistol has a polished blue finish it was probably taken from a pre-1950 Colt Government Model. It could have also come from a USGI M1911, and if it did, the essentially black color of the bluing would suggest one made between 1918 and 1924. Another possibility is that it came from a Singer M1911A1, though highly unlikely. Yet another possibility is that they modified the stock thumb safety to look like the older style safety, but that's unlikely too. It would be a lot of work plus rebluing, whereas just replacing the safety with an older one only takes a minute.

The reason it couldn't have been stock on that pistol is, the pistol is a Series 70, which didn't exist until about 20 years after Colt had stopped using partial-shelf thumb safeties (they've reintroduced them on some of their pistols somewhat recently, but that's not relevant to what was going on in the '70s and '80s).

As I said in post #35:

There were at least three different props used for Magnum's pistol (not counting the Star Model B and BM anomalies), or possibly the same prop at three different stages of modifications:

1. Colt S70 CGM 9mm Luger with nickel-plated trigger (some S70s came like that stock), stock full-shelf thumb safety, replacement grips (fully checkered walnut, no medallions).
2. Same as above except with a blued trigger (some S70s came stock like that as well).
3. Same as #2 except with a partial-shelf thumb safety.

[To The Regiment]

Interestingly, neither the Magnum, PI Colt owned by ISS nor the one on display at the NRA Museum (which is now closed) appear to be the one in this screenshot:



Note the apparent scratch on this Colt's slide near the end.

Yeah, that prop, which was used in at least several episodes, is particularly interesting because it has a partial-shelf thumb safety, and it absolutely did not come that way from Colt. The one from the NRA museum also had a partial-shelf thumb safety (which you can see in the picture I posted in post #35), so it's probably the same gun. If it isn't, it means that at least two of the props were modified in the same way. The ISS one has its stock full-shelf thumb safety like Colt has been using since the early 1950s, and there are indeed plenty of episodes where Magnum's pistol has the stock full-shelf thumb safety.

Installing a partial-shelf thumb safety was some nice attention to detail, because all USGI M1911s and M1911A1s had a partial-shelf thumb safety (they were all manufactured before Colt introduced the full-shelf thumb safety). Here's a comparison between the stock full-shelf thumb safety on the ISS pistol (top) and the not-stock-for-that-particular-gun partial-shelf thumb safety on the NRA Museum pistol (bottom):



Since the partial-shelf thumb safety on the NRA Museum pistol has a polished blue finish it was probably taken from a pre-1950 Colt Government Model. It could have also come from a USGI M1911, and if it did, the essentially black color of the bluing would suggest one made between 1918 and 1924. Another possibility is that it came from a Singer M1911A1, though highly unlikely. Yet another possibility is that they modified the stock thumb safety to look like the older style safety, but that's unlikely too. It would be a lot of work plus rebluing, whereas just replacing the safety with an older one only takes a minute.

The reason it couldn't have been stock on that pistol is, the pistol is a Series 70, which didn't exist until about 20 years after Colt had stopped using partial-shelf thumb safeties (they've reintroduced them on some of their pistols somewhat recently, but that's not relevant to what was going on in the '70s and '80s).

As I said in post #35:

There were at least three different props used for Magnum's pistol (not counting the Star Model B and BM anomalies), or possibly the same prop at three different stages of modifications:

1. Colt S70 CGM 9mm Luger with nickel-plated trigger (some S70s came like that stock), stock full-shelf thumb safety, replacement grips (fully checkered walnut, no medallions).
2. Same as above except with a blued trigger (some S70s came stock like that as well).
3. Same as #2 except with a partial-shelf thumb safety.

Excellent insight. I hope to visit the NRA Museum to see it if they ever open it back up.

Thanks,
Shannon