Never Again ... Never Again (1.7)

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How Would You Rate This Episode?

10 (Perfect!)
1
1%
9.5 (One of the Best)
15
11%
9.0 (Excellent)
40
30%
8.5 (Very Good)
34
26%
8.0 (Pretty Good)
24
18%
7.5 (Decent)
10
8%
7.0 (Average at Best)
5
4%
6.5 (Not So Good)
2
2%
6.0 (Pretty Bad)
0
No votes
5.0 (Just Awful)
1
1%
 
Total votes: 132

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Danny Lin
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Re: Never Again ... Never Again (1.7)

#106 Post by Danny Lin »

On an intentional dislocation:

When Magnum brings Lena to the estate he gives Higgins a call, from the Audi´s Phone, because the Lads hinder him to leave the car. Higgins puts down the Phone and walks up to a window to take a look at Magnums situation. The Window Higgins walks up to is one of the windows leaning towards the houses front yard that is surrounded by the low grey wall. But when Higgins reaches the window, there is a sequence cut in which shows what he sees through the window, which, besides the Lads, is Magnum and Lena sitting in the Audi respectively the Ferrari, in the background the estates third car "Robin 3".
Since every one knows from episode one, that the cars can not even be driven into the front yard, because of the wall and since everyone knows from previous episodes that the estates cars are parked in the area in front of the main door, this sequence means a "violent dislocation". That´s a no go!
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Re: Never Again ... Never Again (1.7)

#107 Post by Danny Lin »

On the impersonation of Nazis on TV:

Like in this episode of "Magnum P.I." I find the impersonation of Nazis on TV often to be too pithy. They are characterized as wild, screaming, throat slitting monsters, certainly often blond and blue eyed.

When in fact in most cases their true monstrosity was (and is!) well hidden under a totally inconspicuous outward appearance. Almost anyone in any average neighbourhood could (and can!) be a Nazi, following their sick view of life secretly and silently. Or just be a sympathizer, secretly sharing their views and supporting them.

Yah, well, television...
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Mad Kudu Buck
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Re: Never Again ... Never Again (1.7)

#108 Post by Mad Kudu Buck »

I thought the woman who played Lena (Hanna Hertelendy) did an amazing job. I still get goosebumps when I watch the scene where she screams, "It was WAR!"
Danny Lin wrote:On the impersonation of Nazis on TV:
Yes, they always go too obvious. They also go too obvious the other way when showing Jewish characters - always friendly, intelligent and innocent. Has there ever been a psychotic murdering Jewish character or an evil perverted Rabbi? There are plenty of psychotic Christian religious freak characters and sexually deviant priests.
Turkey wrote:Loved the 'day for night' shooting - old school! :D

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Day_for_night
Oh yes, I love day for night shooting. It usually looks far more realistic than bright spotlights all over the place.

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Re: Never Again ... Never Again (1.7)

#109 Post by MagnumILWU »

I watched this episode tonight on COZI. When it aired, the 'old' couple, Saul and Lena were 57 and 60 yrs old! Tomorrow Tom Selleck will turn 73! This blows my mind!
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Re: Never Again ... Never Again (1.7)

#110 Post by Bat22 »

I was oblivious to the original broadcast's gunshot. It makes sense to me as Lena's "suicide by Magnum" and Magnum acting in self-defense. Even though guns trump knives according to The Untouchables, a knife can be even deadlier than a pistol in a tight space with a small target. But I find TM's sad contemplation understandable even with the syndicated possibility that Lena surrendered herself; he's mourning the loss of the good people he thought the Greenbergs were and whom he also cared for.

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Re: Never Again ... Never Again (1.7)

#111 Post by Mad Kudu Buck »

I'm surprised nobody questions the legality of what the Israelis were doing. These are foreign agents coming into the country to hunt down, drug, kidnap, remove from the country and possibly kill US citizens (who were once German, but now American). The audience is just expected to accept that. I thought Americans were more proud of their sovereignty than that. Can other foreign agents do that, or is that a special right only reserved for Israelis?

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Re: Never Again ... Never Again (1.7)

#112 Post by K Hale »

Mad Kudu Buck wrote:I'm surprised nobody questions the legality of what the Israelis were doing. These are foreign agents coming into the country to hunt down, drug, kidnap, remove from the country and possibly kill US citizens (who were once German, but now American). The audience is just expected to accept that. I thought Americans were more proud of their sovereignty than that. Can other foreign agents do that, or is that a special right only reserved for Israelis?
It's probably illegal as heck, but since they were Nazis I'm OK with it.

::looks the other way::
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Re: Never Again ... Never Again (1.7)

#113 Post by MagnumILWU »

Mad Kudu Buck wrote:I'm surprised nobody questions the legality of what the Israelis were doing. These are foreign agents coming into the country to hunt down, drug, kidnap, remove from the country and possibly kill US citizens (who were once German, but now American). The audience is just expected to accept that. I thought Americans were more proud of their sovereignty than that. Can other foreign agents do that, or is that a special right only reserved for Israelis?
Yes, bring us your tired, your weak, and nazi war criminals! By any chance, are you wearing a brown shirt?
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K Hale
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Re: Never Again ... Never Again (1.7)

#114 Post by K Hale »

MagnumILWU wrote:
Mad Kudu Buck wrote:I'm surprised nobody questions the legality of what the Israelis were doing. These are foreign agents coming into the country to hunt down, drug, kidnap, remove from the country and possibly kill US citizens (who were once German, but now American). The audience is just expected to accept that. I thought Americans were more proud of their sovereignty than that. Can other foreign agents do that, or is that a special right only reserved for Israelis?
Yes, bring us your tired, your weak, and nazi war criminals! By any chance, are you wearing a brown shirt?
Whoa man :shock: there's nothing wrong about standing up for law and order and not vigilantism. I make an exception for Nazi hunters, but I respect the Kudu Buck's position.

Besides, they could have killed Higgins but only tranq'd him, so they get extra consideration for that too.
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Re: Never Again ... Never Again (1.7)

#115 Post by ConchRepublican »

K Hale wrote:
Mad Kudu Buck wrote:I'm surprised nobody questions the legality of what the Israelis were doing. These are foreign agents coming into the country to hunt down, drug, kidnap, remove from the country and possibly kill US citizens (who were once German, but now American). The audience is just expected to accept that. I thought Americans were more proud of their sovereignty than that. Can other foreign agents do that, or is that a special right only reserved for Israelis?
It's probably illegal as heck, but since they were Nazis I'm OK with it.

::looks the other way::
I agree K Hale . . . I'm sure it would be a huge international incident and is illegal, just as I'm sure things like this happened after The War. I'm also in the look the other way camp. I know I shouldn't be, but considering the circumstances, well, it falls under the "go ahead, but don't make me look stupid category".
MagnumILWU wrote:Yes, bring us your tired, your weak, and nazi war criminals! By any chance, are you wearing a brown shirt?
Yeah, I'd pump the brakes on that response . . .
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Re: Never Again ... Never Again (1.7)

#116 Post by MagnumILWU »

ConchRepublican wrote:
K Hale wrote:
Mad Kudu Buck wrote:I'm surprised nobody questions the legality of what the Israelis were doing. These are foreign agents coming into the country to hunt down, drug, kidnap, remove from the country and possibly kill US citizens (who were once German, but now American). The audience is just expected to accept that. I thought Americans were more proud of their sovereignty than that. Can other foreign agents do that, or is that a special right only reserved for Israelis?
It's probably illegal as heck, but since they were Nazis I'm OK with it.

::looks the other way::
I agree K Hale . . . I'm sure it would be a huge international incident and is illegal, just as I'm sure things like this happened after The War. I'm also in the look the other way camp. I know I shouldn't be, but considering the circumstances, well, it falls under the "go ahead, but don't make me look stupid category".
MagnumILWU wrote:Yes, bring us your tired, your weak, and nazi war criminals! By any chance, are you wearing a brown shirt?
Yeah, I'd pump the brakes on that response . . .
Yeah, you probably would! Any body who agrees with, or condones mad kudu buck's statement, should be ashamed of themselves!
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Re: Never Again ... Never Again (1.7)

#117 Post by ☨magnum.t »

Ivan had to go....sometimes Nazis have to go. Ironically extradition from Israel is not done for any country and any person ever born Jewish no matter where are considered Israeli. I'm sure if the Agents were caught by anyone they would also have "diplomatic immunity". Also What's legal is not always what's just or right.
That reminds me of the time....

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Re: Never Again ... Never Again (1.7)

#118 Post by Luther's nephew Dobie »

☨magnum.t wrote:Ivan had to go....sometimes Nazis have to go. Ironically extradition from Israel is not done for any country and any person ever born Jewish no matter where are considered Israeli. I'm sure if the Agents were caught by anyone they would also have "diplomatic immunity". Also What's legal is not always what's just or right.
The Nazis crimes weren't just directed at one group or nation but against humanity. We all know the details. The monstrous characters on this episode had evaded getting
caught and were beyond legal retribution.
In that situation, who speaks for the dead, the untold millions?
In this case I don't believe Civilization owes these two murdering Nazi bastards anything, no honor, no ethics, no moral/legal code when it comes to battling such evil once they are beyond the reach of the Law.
Just as in Magnum's method for dealing with Ivan, as you cited above.
William Lloyd Garrison had it right:
"With reasonable men I will reason. With humane men I will plead. But to tyrants I will give no quarter nor waste arguments".
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Re: Never Again ... Never Again (1.7)

#119 Post by marlboro »

Honestly, I agree with Mad Kudu Buck. I don't like the idea of foreign countries slipping agents into the USA and kidnapping people. The US and Israel are allies - state your case and get the Nazis extradited through legal channels. It wouldn't be much of an episode if it went down that way though.

To compare it to another Magnum episode, what if the Kenyan government kidnapped Higgins and put him on trial for what his troops did during the uprising? "BUT HIGGINS WAS INNOCENT THOUGH!" Which is exactly my point. We are a nation of laws. If we can't, or worse won't, protect our citizens even to the extent of giving them a trial before letting them get dragged off to a foreign country, then what's the point?

I revere justice over the rule of law, but if I'm honest, I have to say it's MY idea of justice that I favor. Other people have very different ideas of what justice really is. That's why the law is important. It's what keeps justice from becoming revenge, or oppression.

having said that. I still love it when Magnum shoots Ivan though. ;) But it's easier on tv because we know who the bad guys are.

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Re: Never Again ... Never Again (1.7)

#120 Post by marlboro »

MagnumILWU wrote: Yeah, you probably would! Any body who agrees with, or condones mad kudu buck's statement, should be ashamed of themselves!
I would just like to point out something here - politics ruins everything. We're all friends here. We can disagree about stuff without losing our tempers. Why not give people the benefit of the doubt instead of immediately jumping to the conclusion that what they said can only be interpreted in the worst way possible?

* This does not apply to the godless heretics who want to see Magnum rebooted. Killing's too good for those monsters.

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