Past Tense (3.5)

Rate, review & discuss the episodes from the third season

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How Would You Rate This Episode?

10 (Perfect!)
2
2%
9.5 (One of the Best)
4
4%
9.0 (Excellent)
18
18%
8.5 (Very Good)
31
31%
8.0 (Pretty Good)
26
26%
7.5 (Decent)
12
12%
7.0 (Average at Best)
3
3%
6.5 (Not So Good)
4
4%
6.0 (Pretty Bad)
0
No votes
5.0 (Just Awful)
1
1%
 
Total votes: 101

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Braddah Kimo
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#51 Post by Braddah Kimo »

e kala mai. I'm sorry. it WAS Val kilmer. not russel.

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ZelenskyTheValiant (Ivan)
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#52 Post by ZelenskyTheValiant (Ivan) »

Braddah Kimo wrote:e kala mai. I'm sorry. it WAS Val kilmer. not russel.
Braddah Kimo must have TOMBSTONE on his mind. Hence confusing Kurt Russell with Val Kilmer. :?

Anyway this episode was excellent - easy 9.0 from me. After the terrific "Did You See the Sun Rise?" we got two mediocre-to-fairly-good episodes "Ki'i's Don't Lie" and "The Eighth Part of the Village". Here we're back at the top of the game again - lots of outdoorsy action, helicopter flying, prison breaks, revenge plots, awesome jogging opening with the car explosion, and great chemistry between T.C. and Higgy-Baby. Even a cool showdown in an old WWII bunker.

Anyway, the next 3 episodes are even more terrific than this one. Amongst my all-time favorite MPI's in fact! Season 3 seems to be shaping up as the best season of the show!

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Re: Past Tense (3.5)

#53 Post by Kudu buck »

I raise up this post about one year after.
The third season is a great season even this episode is one the weakest and James Wainwright is an outstanding and tough villain. So my vote is 8.
I enjoyed to find the yet unknown (or at least I think so) location of the Halawa prison. The real Halawa Correctional Facility is located on Moanalua Road, but the fictional location is at 475 22nd Avenue. They used the facilities of the hawaiian Department of Education.

Image Image
They filmed in the parking of the department. yeah this is definitely a parking. look at the stripes :o
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By way after the chopper accident they evidently lost the path during the "Death march". Infact during the episode we can see some brief footages showing different hawaiian locations. They must have walked all around the islands :D
Here is the Waipio Valley and Hiilawe Falls on Big Island
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Here is Halawa Bay on the east shore of Molokai
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i wasn't able to find this one. help!
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marlboro
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Re: Past Tense (3.5)

#54 Post by marlboro »

I liked this episode and didn't find it that confusing.

Three years earlier Lyden had been selling weapons to mercenaries. Magnum infiltrates his organization and busts him.


Was the prison break implausible?

The multiple links to Helicopter related prison breaks have already dispelled that question.


There were also a couple of questions about the prison break earlier in the thread:.

How did he start the riot?

Obviously, Lyden payed a few of the inmates to set those dumpsters on fire. Prisons are powder kegs. I don't think it would take much to set the rest of the inmates off.

Who was the man in Lyden's cell?

The man in the cell was a minor crook (a paper hanger) who he had previously convinced/coerced to slip into his cell in his place when the guards were locking down the prison during the riot. That way the authorities would spend time looking for the wrong man - they believed the paper hanger had escaped when all the while he was just sitting in Lyden's cell. This would give Lyden plenty of time to kill Magnum and make his escape.

Why didn't Lyden just shoot Magnum on sight?

Lyden still considers himself a soldier and not just a criminal - he tries to pretend that he was doing a noble thing by selling guns to the mercs. Magnum destroys his facade by pointing out that he left another group of soldiers to be wiped out because they couldn't pay him enough. I think Lyden knows that he is just a crook with blood on his hands but he doesn't want to admit it. He wants to punish Magnum for the mercenaries death, but deep down he knows he is really at fault. His desire to erase his own guilt is why he doesn't just waste Magnum on sight.

What did the car wreck at the beginning have to do with Lyden's plan?

Lyden combines his plot to escape prison and his quest for revenge into one stratagem. While his men are kidnapping TC he simultaneously sends his associate with the French sounding name to deliver a message to Magnum. Presumably, that message would be "I have TC, come to this location if you want to see him again alive. Do not contact the authorities or else" His plan falls apart when his associate is killed by the reckless driver before he can reach Robin's Nest. He expected to have enough time to eliminate Magnum and make his escape,while the authorities were still looking for the minor crook who was pretending to be Lyden in his cell. When the Frenchman was killed Lyden's plan was already ruined. He wasn't able to set magnum up the way he wanted, and he lost his only means of escaping the island.


How did he know Higgins?

He's a smart guy. He knew about Robin's Nest. It isn't a stretch that he would get as much info on Magnum's friends as possible.

Why didn't the bad guys just kill Higgins and TC?

They would have if it had been up to the "hired muscle." They thought the plan was just to escape and secure a weapons cache. But Lyden knew he would need at least one or both of the the hostages to keep Magnum from coming in with guns blazing. TC would have been the ideal hostage, but he was wounded and likely dying so Higgins had to be kept as insurance.


Just my thoughts. I may be wrong about all of it. ;)

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Doc Ibold
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Re: Past Tense (3.5)

#55 Post by Doc Ibold »

marlboro wrote:I liked this episode and didn't find it that confusing.

Three years earlier Lyden had been selling weapons to mercenaries. Magnum infiltrates his organization and busts him.


Was the prison break implausible?

The multiple links to Helicopter related prison breaks have already dispelled that question.


There were also a couple of questions about the prison break earlier in the thread:.

How did he start the riot?

Obviously, Lyden payed a few of the inmates to set those dumpsters on fire. Prisons are powder kegs. I don't think it would take much to set the rest of the inmates off.

Who was the man in Lyden's cell?

The man in the cell was a minor crook (a paper hanger) who he had previously convinced/coerced to slip into his cell in his place when the guards were locking down the prison during the riot. That way the authorities would spend time looking for the wrong man - they believed the paper hanger had escaped when all the while he was just sitting in Lyden's cell. This would give Lyden plenty of time to kill Magnum and make his escape.

Why didn't Lyden just shoot Magnum on sight?

Lyden still considers himself a soldier and not just a criminal - he tries to pretend that he was doing a noble thing by selling guns to the mercs. Magnum destroys his facade by pointing out that he left another group of soldiers to be wiped out because they couldn't pay him enough. I think Lyden knows that he is just a crook with blood on his hands but he doesn't want to admit it. He wants to punish Magnum for the mercenaries death, but deep down he knows he is really at fault. His desire to erase his own guilt is why he doesn't just waste Magnum on sight.

What did the car wreck at the beginning have to do with Lyden's plan?

Lyden combines his plot to escape prison and his quest for revenge into one stratagem. While his men are kidnapping TC he simultaneously sends his associate with the French sounding name to deliver a message to Magnum. Presumably, that message would be "I have TC, come to this location if you want to see him again alive. Do not contact the authorities or else" His plan falls apart when his associate is killed by the reckless driver before he can reach Robin's Nest. He expected to have enough time to eliminate Magnum and make his escape,while the authorities were still looking for the minor crook who was pretending to be Lyden in his cell. When the Frenchman was killed Lyden's plan was already ruined. He wasn't able to set magnum up the way he wanted, and he lost his only means of escaping the island.


How did he know Higgins?

He's a smart guy. He knew about Robin's Nest. It isn't a stretch that he would get as much info on Magnum's friends as possible.

Why didn't the bad guys just kill Higgins and TC?

They would have if it had been up to the "hired muscle." They thought the plan was just to escape and secure a weapons cache. But Lyden knew he would need at least one or both of the the hostages to keep Magnum from coming in with guns blazing. TC would have been the ideal hostage, but he was wounded and likely dying so Higgins had to be kept as insurance.


Just my thoughts. I may be wrong about all of it. ;)
I think you pretty much hit the nail on the head. Like you said, I didn't find it too confusing, and it is one of the "buddy episodes" which really showcases the bond. To me, the plot leading up to it is kind of secondary.

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Milton Collins
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Re: Past Tense (3.5)

#56 Post by Milton Collins »

I'll agree that this plot was a little unbelievable and hard to follow but I think this was a pretty solid episode. I instantly recognized Lyden as the actor from an Incredible Hulk episode where he played a character called "Papa Hemingway" who was an escaped mental patient. As I had recently watched that Hulk episode it was hard to picture him as a griseled and coldblooded ex soldier and killer. Anyway, I liked the split of Higgins/TC and TM/Rick. It was fun to see them split into teams and work together. Higgins continued storytelling and babbling was quite hilarious as well. This was one of the first Magnum's I ever saw so maybe that's why I can withstand the weak plot lol.

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Milton Collins
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Re: Past Tense (3.5)

#57 Post by Milton Collins »

I'll agree that this plot was a little unbelievable and hard to follow but I think this was a pretty solid episode. I instantly recognized Lyden as the actor from an Incredible Hulk episode where he played a character called "Papa Hemingway" who was an escaped mental patient. As I had recently watched that Hulk episode it was hard to picture him as a griseled and coldblooded ex soldier and killer. Anyway, I liked the split of Higgins/TC and TM/Rick. It was fun to see them split into teams and work together. Higgins continued storytelling and babbling was quite hilarious as well. This was one of the first Magnum's I ever saw so maybe that's why I can withstand the weak plot lol.

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Re: Past Tense (3.5)

#58 Post by SignGuyHPW »

I thought that this one was good, but a bit confusing. The interplay with TC and Higgins was pretty interesting as they were really defending each other.

What confused me was how the guys were all connected and how the plan was supposed to happen. What was the guy in the wreck supposed to have done had he not been killed a few yards from Robin's nest? How was Lydon able to organise that precise of a jail break from inside using mainland muscle? How did he know Higgins so well since he'd have been in jail the entire time Magnum knew Higgins? Why was he not in a federal prison if it was the Navy that arrested him?

The interaction between Tanaka and Magnum plus the interaction between TC and Higgins really made the episode for me. Both were really strong. The uniform cop that was doing the report showing a bit more logic than Magnum was kind of a unique twist as well. It was one of the few times that Magnum didn't figure out the legal aspects by himself. Higgins being worried about Mr. Master's cameras right after the crash landing was classic too.

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Derek
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Re: Past Tense (3.5)

#59 Post by Derek »

I really liked this episode despite it's shortcomings (landing in a prison with a helicopter to rescure an inmate is not realistic IMO, yes, however, lots of similarly unrealistic scenes can be found in the series and we love it anyway).

Past Tense is one of my favorites because while watching, I immediately recognized Waipio Valley, which I visited during my trip to Hawai'i. That was such a nice day trip! I'll be there again if there's a chance to get back to HI. I went down to the valley with a rental Jeep Wrangler Sport (it's only permitted for 4WD) and encountered some of the wild horses there. While taking some pictures after getting out, one of them started rooting through my backpack, wich was still in the car in front of the passengers seat! There is even a picture of the horse putting its head through the window... I should really start to prepare some pictures for my posts:)

A similar incident happened later when going back from the beach to the place where the car was parked. All of a sudden, I found myself surrounded by those horses, but I could bribe them into letting me through by giving them some bananas.

So, this post does not really focus on the series, but it probably explains why I like this episode :)
Oh, and Higgins' stories are enjoyable, too.
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Re: Past Tense (3.5)

#60 Post by Milton Collins »

Just watched this one again. I find this plot/connection to be very vague/complex and hard to understand. This was probably the fifth or sixth time I've seen this one over many years and I think i finally put together all the connections between Magnum and Lyden and the French guy who got killed in the car accident. Why go to all the extreme effort of rescuing Lyden and then kidnapping Higgins and TC and traipsing them all across the island just for a machine gun vs pistol clad Magnum showdown? Meaning was this the point? If it was it was pretty stupid as he could've easily left and gotten away after killing his partners. And if he wanted revenge that bad why not just blow TM away on arrival? Oh well, when I ask too many questions like this I remind myself "it had to happen for there to be this episode" and I love Magnum to death so I'll just shut up lol. Not a bad episode as I gave it an 8. Loved the Higgins and TC scenes while they were captive. But certainly not a top or favorite episode. Season three is so damn outstanding (my personal fav season) that this isn't one I watch very often.

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Re: Past Tense (3.5)

#61 Post by KingKC »

I distinctly remember the last scenes including Higgins "administering" to TC with his talking and TM walking up to the "pillbox/bunker" and wondering why the bad guy just didn't blow TM away. A lot of this episode was pretty convoluted as to a believable plot. It was mostly gratuitous action and suspense but generally enjoyable.

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Re: Past Tense (3.5)

#62 Post by thechickinthemiddle »

Anyone else notice that Higgins' explanation for telling his stories to a shot T.C. was so T.C. wouldn't slip into a coma? In "Under World", Higgins' stories are exactly what rouses T.C. out of his coma. (Granted, it was because T.C. didn't want to hear said stories anymore, but it's heartwarming nonetheless.) :)

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Re: Past Tense (3.5)

#63 Post by Little Garwood »

I don't recall how I voted on "Past Tense", but it had to be an 8.5 or 9.0. I saw this episode first run--along with the rest of S3, which was the peak of my childhood MPI interest and still my favorite season.

It seems that the criticisms of this episode stem from the plot, but that never registered with me because I instead focused on the tremendous character bonding that goes on in it.

"Past Tense" is one of the earlier "characters banding together and looking out for each other" episodes and it is for that reason that I rate it so highly. I loved it how Higgins looked after TC and how TM and Rick worked together to find them. TM's voice over summation about their friendship and how fragile a thing it is, Higgins and TC "back to normal" as their arguing will attest, and best of all, Magnum's great smile, which says it all to me as to how he feels about those three guys.

That is why I rate "Past Tense" as highly as I do.

"Past Tense" is essentially a dry run for even better "Band of Brothers" episodes like "Home from the Sea" and "All for One", to name but two.

The next time you watch "Past Tense", watch it not for the well-worn prison escape-and-vengeance plot, but rather the four main characters' regard for one another.
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Re: Past Tense (3.5)

#64 Post by K Hale »

thechickinthemiddle wrote:Anyone else notice that Higgins' explanation for telling his stories to a shot T.C. was so T.C. wouldn't slip into a coma? In "Under World", Higgins' stories are exactly what rouses T.C. out of his coma. (Granted, it was because T.C. didn't want to hear said stories anymore, but it's heartwarming nonetheless.) :)
And both times, the stories were unusually graphic for Higgins: in "Underworld" it's a child being tortured and in "Past Tense" it's about a guy who had his eyelids slit. Clearly he knows what grabs your attention in an emergency! :shock:

I liked this episode because Higgins/TC match ups are awesome. The plot was pretty complex and this thread, especially marlboro's post, helped answer the three major questions I had about what was going on, but I still am not clear on how Lyden knew so much about Higgins since Lyden was already in prison when Magnum moved in at Robin's Nest. I supposed it's one of those situations where information is smuggled in to prisoners by someone on the outside? The guy who played Lyden did a terrific job, too.
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Re: Past Tense (3.5)

#65 Post by karolis »

IslandHopper wrote: Maybe it's just that the events were too unbelievable beginning with TC's chopper landing in the middle of the prison yard and escaping with Lyden just after the prison riot begins. I am always reminded of this scene whenever I see Dr. Evil and Mini-Me asking their fellow inmates to start a riot so they can escape in “Goldmember.” Why would these inmates start a diversion and risk severe punishment and even death so that Lyden can escape? First, I find it hard to believe that the chopper wouldn't have been disabled by the guards firing at the engine before it took off.
I liked this episode, maybe "suspension of disbelief" is in my blood. I see your point about the riot. I mean it's possible that fellow inmates may start a riot for Morgan Lyden to escape for some benefits or threatening. But why then Tanaka would say that maybe Morgan Lyden made some enemies in prison, to explain why would he escape if he had only 6 months of sentence. Obviously he had more friends there than enemies.
J.J. Walters wrote:
golfmobile wrote:Well, we've made fun the helicopter escape plotline; however, it was done this weekend -- for the SECOND time by the same convicts!

Helicopter Prison Break

golf
Wow, what a story! Unbelievable. :shock:

And the chopper was commandeered, with the pilot forced to fly to the prison, just like T.C. in this episode! It appears that they timed the "rescue" to when the two convicts were on their daily walk in the courtyard. Were they the only ones in the courtyard? If not, wouldn't you think other convicts (particularly "lifers") would try to get on the chopper? This is what is still so unbelievable about the "Past Tense" scene; The other convicts create a diversion and help shield Lydon onto the chopper (which in itself is a little farfetched), yet none of them also try to escape?
Just googled and was surprised how much such escapes was planned and done:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_h ... on_escapes


I believe i just found a flub. When T.C. is flying Higgins and the bad guys (before they pull the guns) T.C.'s chopper number starts with N5 and ends with 43:

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During the escape in prison T.C.'s chopper number is N1095A:

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During the flight from prison to island T.C. chopper number changes back to N59243 (it may be N98243 or N90243):

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And when the chopper crashed - it doesn't have any number at all:

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It's clearly visible that real Yacht name was covered with King Kamehameha II:

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Notice the fly on Magnum's chin:

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I believe it supposed to be a remote island where T.C.'s chopper with T.C., Higgins and bad guys crashed, but in the top right you can see some kind of factory:

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Obvious Rick double:

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Somebody left the bag:

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Season 3 Top up to this episode:
1-2. Did You See the Sunrise?
3. The Eighth Part of the Village
4. Past Tense
5. Ki'i's Don't Lie

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