The Elmo Ziller Story (2.21)

Rate, review & discuss the episodes from the second season

Moderator: Styles Bitchley

How Would You Rate This Episode?

10 (Perfect!)
0
No votes
9.5 (One of the Best)
17
15%
9.0 (Excellent)
13
12%
8.5 (Very Good)
31
28%
8.0 (Pretty Good)
27
24%
7.5 (Decent)
10
9%
7.0 (Average at Best)
7
6%
6.5 (Not So Good)
2
2%
6.0 (Pretty Bad)
2
2%
5.0 (Just Awful)
2
2%
 
Total votes: 111

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thechickinthemiddle
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Re: The Elmo Ziller Story (2.21)

#71 Post by thechickinthemiddle »

Not to totally give away my age, but Marcella Ziller looks like Jessie J auditioning for Little Orphan Annie :P

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Seriously though, I'm glad that despite Barbara Rhoades playing a similar (though more classy-dressed) character on Diagnosis: Murder, her career wasn't entirely comprised of antagonistic stepmother roles.

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KingKC
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Re: The Elmo Ziller Story (2.21)

#72 Post by KingKC »

This may have been one of the most fun episodes of all. Hillerman was great in this double role and, IMO, should have left it at that rather than trying to be Father Paddy and Don Luis. This solidified the ability of MPI to be creative and ingenious. I think the lighthearted approach helped keep the show going.

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#73 Post by thechickinthemiddle »

Carol the Dabbler wrote:One might think that Magnum -- who was already nearly certain that "Elmo" was actually Higgins -- would have been absolutely positive the whole thing was a hoax when he saw Agatha Chumley pretending to be Sylvia the front-desk clerk! :wink:

LOL!

Full disclosure: I've come back to this particular thread numerous times just to read the above quote. :P

Of course the irony is that Sylvia is rather firm and steely while Agatha is... not (at least not usually, no disrespect to Agatha).

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Re: The Elmo Ziller Story (2.21)

#74 Post by jeffran »

I really love this fun and (relatively) light-hearted episode. Great performance by John Hillerman. And wow, Lexi Ziller.

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K Hale
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Re: The Elmo Ziller Story (2.21)

#75 Post by K Hale »

jeffran wrote:I really love this fun and (relatively) light-hearted episode. Great performance by John Hillerman. And wow, Lexi Ziller.

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It was not until I started reading this forum that I realized this is the same actress who played the IRA terrorist in "No Need to Know." Excellent.
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Re: The Elmo Ziller Story (2.21)

#76 Post by K Hale »

Milton Collins wrote:
I watched this one again last night and they really gave the impression that this story was going to get re-visited. Elmo was confirmed to have gotten to Mexico, there was going to be a search by his daughter, the daughter promised to return with the rodeo, and the niece getting into Higgins' life for the first time all screamed of follow up episode. Does anyone know why they didn't ever bring it back?
I just watched this again, a very fun episode! And I totally agree Styles, I got the impression that this story would be rivisited/continued later on. I think it would have made for an outstanding episode to see Bronco Elmo "return from the dead" and for he and his daughter to head back to visit Higgins and TM. I still crack up at Rick and TC dressed as rodeo clowns when I watch this one lol. Fun episode, liked seeing it again.
This episode was tons of fun and well deserved a sequel, which it certainly sounded like they planned to do.
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thechickinthemiddle
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Re: The Elmo Ziller Story (2.21)

#77 Post by thechickinthemiddle »

K Hale wrote:This episode was tons of fun and well deserved a sequel, which it certainly sounded like they planned to do.
Like with "Thank Heaven for Little Girls", it's very strange to not see the perp apprehended for their bigger crime. (It happened in "Deja Vu" too, but with Duncan Scott it made sense, given the organization he was a part of.)

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Re: The Elmo Ziller Story (2.21)

#78 Post by ENSHealy »

2.21 THE ELMO ZILLER STORY
Hawaiian shirts: 1 red with broad blue palm leaves
Island Hopper shirts: 0
Body Count: 0
Shirtless Thomas: 0
Little Voice: 1
I know what you’re thinking: 2
When I write HTBAWCPI: 0
Higgins musings: 3 (1919, D-day, polo in India)
4th wall breaks: 1
Negotiations: 0
Magnumometer: 8

To add to the Hill Country/El Paso flub, in the scene where Elmo is shot, they only fire the rifle once, but when describing the scene to Magnum, "Elmo" mentions 3 shots. Now obviously, "Elmo" wasn't there, so couldn't have known how many shots, but why have him say three shots without establishing some background for it? Maybe three shots were scripted/filmed but later edited out for time?

BTW, given the amount of flame shown in the cab of that pickup before they cut away from that scene...Elmo did not make it to Mexico, no matter how much darling Lexi wants to believe. I suppose he could have been thrown from the truck by the explosion, but it looked like he was wedged in there pretty good between the dash and the seat.

Hilarious that Higgins refers to his father as "the flower of British manhood" and I love that his mother "never allowed the beast to touch her again." Ahhh, marriage.

Last but not least, here are your "I know what you're thinking"s and the little voice:

I know what you're thinking, but this time you're wrong. Higgins was up to something, but as long as I knew
he was trying to trick me, I was ok, right? It's only when you don't know you're involved in a practical joke that you're in danger.

I know what you're thinking. Just because I couldn't pull off the moustache, even though I'd seen a bronc ride that would've killed a normal man, somehow I knew it was Higgins hiding under that 10-gallon hat. And I knew one way for sure to prove it.

There weren't very many Zillers registered at any of the major hotels. Not any named Marcella, anyway. I was headed downtown to the courthouse to check on her Hawaii residence, but at the same time, my little voice was also telling me I was headed on a wild goose chase.
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Mad Kudu Buck
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Re: The Elmo Ziller Story (2.21)

#79 Post by Mad Kudu Buck »

ENSHealy wrote:I know what you're thinking. Just because I couldn't pull off the moustache, even though I'd seen a bronc ride that would've killed a normal man, somehow I knew it was Higgins hiding under that 10-gallon hat. And I knew one way for sure to prove it.
10-gallon hat? What is that... something like 38 litres? How big is that in cubic centimetres?

I always need to convert to metric to find out what the hell Americans are talking about. :P

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K Hale
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Re: The Elmo Ziller Story (2.21)

#80 Post by K Hale »

He should've taken into account the reality that Higgins is not a normal man. :lol:
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karolis
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Re: The Elmo Ziller Story (2.21)

#81 Post by karolis »

MaiTaiMan wrote:As I stated in my post/rating for the episode "Billy Joe Bob"...I do not really like cowboy/western type episodes or movies! They're just too "hick/hillbilly" for my taste. I know usually they're supposed to be for humor purposes...but they're not funny--just stupid! :?

"The Elmo Ziller Story" was no different...it was so ridiculous and dumb that I usually end up thinking about something else while it's on. I think John Hillerman is an awesome actor and can play different roles very well. Ironically he also is in reality from Texas--so maybe that's why he wanted to play the dual role in this episode. But, I would hope he was not as ridiculously "hick" as he was in this! :shock:

Ironically this season started with a "hick" episode...and almost ended with one too. What saved season 2 is all the other awesome episodes in between. :wink:
I rated this episode quite high - 8.5, just because of funny Higgins/Magnum situations, but i prefer more balanced between serious and humorous episodes and i really don't like cowboy type episodes too. I didn't like Billy Joe Bob too, as well as Adelaide (it's not about cowboys, but i find it kinda similar type because of the horses). I like more views of Hawaii - T.C. flying the chopper, more backstories of Nam, better plot, more dramatic endings. Episodes such as "Italian Ice", "Tropical Madness", "J. "Digger" Doyle", "The Woman on the Beach", "Try to Remember", "Lest We Forget", "Never Again ... Never Again" and "The Last Page" is my type of MPI episodes ;)
rubber chicken wrote:I conducted important research and found that the turtle is seen in at least ten episodes. Sometimes a second turtle can be seen on the opposite fence on the right side of the tennis court (it's clear now it's on the fence and not the wall). That one may have been up as long as the one on the left, but the right side is rarely seen. I didn't check prior to 2.11 or after 2.22 (which would be the next season). I just totally burnt out on looking for turtles. :?

Here's the list with one turtle appearance time for each episode:
2.11 (46:46)
2.12 (11:15)
2.14 (6:31)
2.15 (30:04)
2.16 (19:53)
2.18 (19:19)
2.19 (12:31)
2.20 (18:25)
2.21 posted above
2.22 (28:27)

It's already foggy in my mind since I did this a few days ago, but I think 2.13 and 2.17 didn't show the fence where the turtle(s) would be. I think we can assume they were there though.

2.18 (19:20) - additional turtle on the right side:
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2.22 (25:13)
Image

And the last one enlarged. Unfortunately the deerstalker is gone now, and the pipe seems to have turned into a... bill?
Image

Higgins must have had Rick and T.C. put the turtles up for when elementary school field trips would come to the estate. That was never documented in an episode, sadly. ;)
Here's the screenshot, cropped in and with enhanced contrast from this episode - looks like turtle to me too.

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Here's the shot from the next (2.22) episode - when i started to analyse it i started to see a woodpecker with a nib and a racket in his hands, when i zoomed it in - it started to look like an inflatable elephant with a racket and instead of a nib - it's trunk.

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But i'm sure it's a turtle, i mean it's clearly a green shell, yellow body, with a light hat, holding on the fence with his left hand and racket - in his right, his head is turned back to look towards the tennis court (inside). Now i can't even see an elephant no more. It still kinda looks a little bit similar to woodpecker.

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Hawaii Winds wrote:
Carol the Dabbler wrote:One might think that Magnum -- who was already nearly certain that "Elmo" was actually Higgins -- would have been absolutely positive the whole thing was a hoax when he saw Agatha Chumley pretending to be Sylvia the front-desk clerk! :wink:
Was this Agatha's first appearence in MPI?
No, it was in "Mad Buck Gibson" where Buck crash lands on the beach.
ENSHealy wrote: BTW, given the amount of flame shown in the cab of that pickup before they cut away from that scene...Elmo did not make it to Mexico, no matter how much darling Lexi wants to believe. I suppose he could have been thrown from the truck by the explosion, but it looked like he was wedged in there pretty good between the dash and the seat.
Maybe by some luck he managed to wake up, open the door and get out? But it's hard to imagine him to be far enough from the explosion in so little time, especially being hurt.

-----

Here's my Season Two's Top up to this episode:

1. Tropical Madness (loved this one)
2-3. Memories Are Forever (1 & 2)
4. Italian Ice
5. The Last Page
6. Try to Remember
7. The Woman on the Beach
8. The Jororo Kill
9. Computer Date
10. Dead Man’s Channel
11. Wave Goodbye
12. Texas Lightning
13. Ghost Writer
14. The Elmo Ziller Story
14. The Sixth Position
15. From Moscow to Maui
16. One More Summer
17. Double Jeopardy
18. The Taking of Dick McWilliams
19. Billy Joe Bob
20. Mad Buck Gibson

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Re: The Elmo Ziller Story (2.21)

#82 Post by karolis »

Clearly Higgins/Ziller double trying to stand up:

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Re: The Elmo Ziller Story (2.21)

#83 Post by K Hale »

mandolabar wrote: I'm a fifth-generation south Texas native, and my family owns some land out Highway 90 near Sabinal--and we drive through Hondo to get there. Someone must have really liked the name "Hondo," because it's mentioned again in Season 3...I can't remember the episode, it's the one with the pilot from Waco. Hondo is not at all a big city--it isn't now, and 30 years ago was probably less so...maybe it just *sounds* so Texan.
Probably because it was also the title of John Wayne western. I have a friend in Brackettville and have driven through Hondo a number of times. It is still little more than a wide spot on Hwy 90.
On accents, though. In south Texas--where Hondo is--the only accent you're likely to have is a Mexican one. Anglo speakers don't tend to have accents (I've been told many times that I can't be from Texas, because I don't have an accent)--I think it's due to the many military bases in San Antonio and the fairly diverse and changing population there.
West Texans (Midland/Odessa) have an accent, but the strongest accent in Texas is NORTH Texas--Dallas and environs. They aren't the same. (did I mention Texas is a big place?).
I’m a Dallas resident myself and you are correct with the addition of east Texas. North Texas and east Texas are heavily southern-influenced in culture and history. South and west Texas, not so much.
John Hillerman is from Denison, north of Dallas, and his native accent would have been North Texas. And when he's being Elmo, what he actually sounds like is a south Texan (no real accent, just some word usages that give it away), trying to affect a west Texas accent. All are authentic--but evidently (from the commentary) not all sound like what people expect from a "Texas" accent. :shock:
I guarantee he meant “Elmo’s” accent to sound affected and over the top – he is playing a British guy who is playing a Texan, after all. He shouldn’t have sounded legit. Hillerman said in an interview at some point that playing a character who is playing another character or being fake in some way is not an easy thing to do. And he was very good at it. He did the same sort of thing when he played a hit man in one of the episodes of Mannix that he was in, and also in the feature film The Nickel Ride, in which his character (a mobster) absolutely oozes insincerity. And come to think of it, he also did it to a little lesser extent in Chinatown.

If you want to hear Hillerman pull out his natural Texas accent, watch S7 “Murder By Night” when he plays the Texas lawyer Sam Caldwell.
Visiting Stewardess wrote: Hillerman says [de-'tails] (with the emphasis on the second syllable, the British emphasize the first syllable ['dee-tails]) a few times throughout the series, I have noticed (unfortunately I haven't made note of it, but I may do so in future, if I notice it again).
In Texas, we also say DEEtails, not deTAILS. So I don’t know why he said it that way but he did it so often that I feel like he must have heard some English person pronounce it that way.
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Re: The Elmo Ziller Story (2.21)

#84 Post by KingKC »

My memory fails me sometimes but didn't Higgins use his Texas accent in an episode with Luther Gillis when they went into a bar to play pool??? I think they both got beat up and Magnum got a real laugh from it. I think Higgins may have mentioned something about Hondo, Texas in that scene as well.

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Re: The Elmo Ziller Story (2.21)

#85 Post by K Hale »

KingKC wrote:My memory fails me sometimes but didn't Higgins use his Texas accent in an episode with Luther Gillis when they went into a bar to play pool??? I think they both got beat up and Magnum got a real laugh from it. I think Higgins may have mentioned something about Hondo, Texas in that scene as well.
Yes he did. He gave his name as Elmo Ziller from Hondo, Texas but he didn’t play him the same. I saw a little John Wayne in that scene :lol:
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Billiards.
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